[Cougar Guy]

And, I might mention that sea-run lake trout DO EXIST!!!

grease line, I'd be curious to find out more info about the sea-run Lake Trout you talk about. Everything that I have read seems to indicate that Lake Trout cannot survive in water that is roughly 1/3 or greater, the salinity of the ocean. I thought they were somewhat unique amongst salmon and trout in these regards (not having the ability to adapt to saltwater).

[Long Shank]

Peteh

Comments are correct although I am not experienced in the Canadian side of the GLs fishery. There is really a fine trout and salmonid fishery out here but we currently have many risks due to the invasive species, over 200 in the lakes. A lot of press on the problems now and impacts on the food chain and sport fishery.

Thought you BC fishers might like to see a huge seeforellen brown trout caught last week out of Lake Michigan's Wisconsin side. 39 inches, 29 lbs. What a beast, my dream of intercepting one of these in the river on the fly rod lives one. LOL

Record lake michigan steelhead is 27 lbs.

Cheers

LS

[ironhead]

Nice fish ,shame about the background ,looks like a job for photoshop,sure thats not a Chernobyl fish ,never mind it only has one head.

[Cougar Guy]

I've heard that the warm water outflows of the various industrial plants on the Great Lakes can be a very good place to fish in the winter. They attract fish like a a dropoff, shoal or other "structure".

Long Shank, do you know if that Brown was caught in one of those areas? That is indeed a very nice fish.

[grease line]

Cougar guy - Yeah, I know what you mean about everything you read saying that lakers are the least saltwater tolerant of trout and char. I didn't believe the guy when he told me about sea run lakers, but it's true. I've seen pictures, and read enough reports by now. Supposedly natives catch them on spoons.

Anyways, the populations are in Nunavut and the NWT supposedly, in some rivers draining off our north coast (arctic ocean? not sure exactly...)

And there was mention of them in an article a magazine a couple years ago.....I forget the name....will think of it....Arctic Heli Fishing Adventures offers trips to fish for these boys....at a price though!

[Long Shank]

Yes thats where this brown and many others are caught if you can get your boat out and down the snow covered ice covered launch ramps. We are having a mild winter so this year they can get out. The warm water discharges from the power plants attract the bait fish which attract the trout. Here is a cute comment on this big brown from the GLs Angler web site. if only alewifes could read I am sure they would now be relieved.

"I just received a priority fax from LMAA ( Lake Michigan Alewives Anonymous)
For immediate release:

Gents and Madames: It is truly a great day to be an alewife! The infamous Butcher of Bender was officially caught and NOT released by an angler known only as Spanky. This vile and devastating brown trout has been known to devour up to 200 of our brethren each and every day, without recourse. A grass roots effort to save our heritage from our friends at GLA seems to be working. Support them whenever you can by helping keep the marinas ice-free, as these fine folks have become our friends. Only with their help can we truly hope to recover.

Yours in zooplankton and micro-shrimp,

Alan the Alewife

President
Lake Michigan Alewives Anonymous LLC "

LS

[Cougar Guy]

Very interesting grease line. That could be some fun stuff. I'd love to actually go to Nunavut and spend time fishing around there. When I was in Whitehorse one summer, I talked to a guy that used to live in the NWT and he said the Lake Trout fishing was simply phenominal. He said there are many lakes that he would rather fish than Great Bear and Great Slave. His comment was something like "leave those lakes for the tourists". Anyway, the NWT and Nunavut are on my hit list for an eventual trip.

Long Shank, that is some good comedy relief

[Floon]

Scott, that's the 3rd time I didn't enter to win anything, and the third time I didn't win anything either. What am I doing wrong?
Winless in Delta, (Seattle would have made your "other" put more and better pressure on ya).......

Good to see the good fellows making good.

[IronNoggin]

I an verify what what GreaseLine suggested regarding lakers. In the Western Arctic, there are several examples of lake trout (charr actually) that move between the fresh and salt. Populations on Banks Island are one, and somewhat atypical for the species. There, they generally inhabit river systems as opposed to lakes, and many have been captured well out into the real chuck. Another is Husky Lakes (aka Eskimo Lakes on most maps) which used to be the historic drainage of the mighty Mackenzie, back a couple of ice ages ago. Amongst my many projects while there, was a detailed study of the life history of these particular fish. There are actually two variants of lakers in that system. The population present in the upper chain of lakes spend their entire life in fresh water, yet still reach staggering proportions. What I (amongst many) couldn't understand, was the phenominal growth rates exhibited by the population closest to the outlet to the ocean - literally faster than anywhere else in the world at that latitude, and generally faster growth than exhibited in the majority of southern populations. Upon careful examination, the answer was soon forthcoming. There is a strong run of true Arctic Herring that both spawn and rear in those outer lakes, providing a forage base 24/7/365. Lakers from there had body fat of amazing proportions at ICE OFF each spring, and growth rate analysis exhibited very little slowing over the winter months. Extremely unusual. Even more unusual was the fact that these particular lakers had no problem running out into and beyond the estuary, both chasing smolt herring, and prior to the returning run of spawning herring in ambush. Their salt-water tolerance was simply amazing, and defied all of the literature regarding this species. As a result, those fish grow faster, at a younger age, and top out larger than any other strain I've had the luxury to examine. My best guess is the next world record is currently alive and doing well in those lakes, just waiting for the right bait to be presented.

If anyone is at all interested, my buddy's widow still runs the Sportsfishing Lodge (Saunaktok) on the outermost lake out of Tuktoyaktuk, NWT. I would be happy to give a recommendation. However, that type of trip is not for the faint of heart or light of wallet. It's NOT a do-it-yourselfer!

So, in short, Yes lakers can utilize the ocean habitat much more than the majority of the current literature suggests.

Cheers,
Nog

[Ian Forbes]

Rainbow strains vary a lot from river to river, but they all eventually adapt to their environment. Rainbows have adapted to their new environment all over the world, and have established sustaining runs totally out of sync from the strain they originally came from.

When our west coast stream finally lose the last of their steelhead runs we could always bring some back from the Great Lakes. And, they would adapt over time. It might take more introductions to make any that stick, but there would always be a few to start a new run.

It is interesting to note that in the Cowichan there are Lake dwelling rainbows that migrate down into the Cowichan to spawn at the same time as the resident rainbows do so. And the steelhead also spawn at the same time. How many rainbows of each overlap and cross breed nobody has any way of knowing.

How about winter and summer steelhead that occupy the same river systems? They seem to go their separate ways. There are more questions than answers.

As already mentioned, steelhead are now classified as Pacific Salmon, so why are we having this discussion? If the ONLY documented criteria that determines whether a rainbow is a steelhead is if it migrates to the ocean, then the Great Lakes migrating rainbows are not steelhead (whether or not they orginally came from steelhead stock). But, in our regulations it states rainbows over 20 inches are classified as steelhead. If that is the case then ANY migrating rainbow could be called a steelhead... including those in Kootenay Lake, the Shuswap or Quesnel Lake. Of course, nobody calls the big Gerrard rainbows "steelhead", so why should we call Great Lakes rainbows that migrate to rivers "steelhead"?

The main difference between the Great Lakes rainbow/steelhead and our west coast steelhead is there are few predators in the Great Lakes, other than anglers... AND THERE IS NO COMMERCIAL FISHING!. West Coast steelhead have to suffer El Nino currents, commercial fishing, seals, sea lions, predaceaous birds, mackerel, and having to adjust to changes in salinity.

[Long Shank]

Ian

Unfortunatly there remains some limited commercial netting by the tribes in certain designated parts of the GLs. See link below. Also we have a huge sport fishery on the GLs trolling for salmon and trout. The charter boat captains have figured out how to target the steelhead the last 20 years and take a lot of fish before they return to the rivers.

The commercial netting permitted is for white fish, lake trout, walleye, and yellow perch I beleive. Some salmon are permitted. See the consent order link in the attached link. There is a whole section of the decree starting on page 50 which says what, where, and how the tribe can commercially net.

LS

Indian Netting

This post has been edited by Long Shank: 14 January 2005 - 06:41 PM

[Cougar Guy]

Excellent stuff IronNoggin, thanx for sharing! I just love Lake Trout

[Ian Forbes]

Thanks for the update Long Shank, but I doubt that the First nations bycatch of salmonids would make a dint in the numbers of fish in the Great Lakes. Even the commercial guide boats don't kill anywhere near as many fish as do west coast commercial fish boats. Guide boats have to stop after catching a daily limit. Commercial boats catch as many fish as they possibly can.